This article is located at: http://answering-islam.org.uk/Authors/Khaled/quran_preserved.htm
And it is authored by Mr. Khaled.
Mr. Khaled Wrote:
At the same time, Muslims believe that there are verses in the Quran which say that the previous Revelations have been corrupted:
O thou Apostle! let not those grieve thee who vie in misbelief; or those who say with their mouths 'We believe,' but their hearts do not believe; or of those who are Jews, listeners to a lie, - listeners to other people, but who come not to thee. They pervert the words from their places and say, ' If this is what ye are given, take it; but if ye are not given it, then beware!' but he whom God wishes to mislead, thou canst do nothing with God for him; these are those whose hearts God wishes not to purify, for them in this world is disgrace, and for them in the next is mighty woe, Q5:41; check also Q3:78, Q2:79, Q4:46 and Q5:13.
The Quran even commands the Muslims to believe in the previous Revelations:
who believe in what is revealed to thee (Muhammad), and what was revealed before thee, and of the hereafter they are sure. Q2:4
The Apostle (Muhammad) believes in what is sent down to him from his Lord, and the believers (Muslims) all believe on God, and His angels, and His Books, and His apostles,- we make no difference between any of His apostles,- they say, 'We hear and obey, Thy pardon, O Lord! for to Thee our journey tends. Q2:285
Say (O Muslims), 'We believe in God, and what has been revealed to thee, and what was revealed to Abraham, and Ishmael, and Isaac, and Jacob, and the tribes, and what was given to Moses, and Jesus, and the prophets from their Lord,- we will make no distinction between any of them,- and we are unto Him resigned. Q3:84
These previous Revelations include the following:
We did reveal the Torah (Tawrat), wherein is guidance and a light ... Q5:44
And already have we written in the Psalms (Zabur) after the reminder that the earth shall my righteous servants inherit.' Q21:105
Subsequent to them, we sent Jesus, the son of Mary, confirming the previous scripture, the Torah. We gave him the Gospel (Injil), containing guidance and light, and confirming the previous scriptures, the Torah, and augmenting its guidance and light, and to enlighten the righteous. Q5:46
My Response:
Mr. Khaled's argument is: A) Muslims must believe in the previous scriptures, Tawrat, Zaboor, and Injeel. B) The bible is the tawrat, Zaboor, and injeel. C) The Quran says the word of God cannot be changed. Therefore: D) The bible is the uncorrupted word of God.
Please read the verse of the Quran, he has quoted.
The Quran says: Say (O Muslims), 'We believe in God, and what has been revealed to thee, and what was revealed to Abraham, and Ishmael, and Isaac, and Jacob, and the tribes, and what was given to Moses, and Jesus, and the prophets from their Lord,- we will make no distinction between any of them,- and we are unto Him resigned. 3:84
Please Re-read it, and another similar verse of the Quran I quote below:
The Quran says: We have sent thee inspiration, as We sent it to Noah and the Messengers after him: we sent inspiration to Abraham, Isma'il, Isaac, Jacob and the Tribes, to Jesus, Job, Jonah, Aaron, and Solomon, and to David We gave the Psalms. 4:163
Something is very significant in the above two verses. Something that negates the entire argument of Mr. Khaled!
They list names of the recipients of revelation from God, prior to the last prophet, SAW.
Do you see the names of Mark, Mathew, Luke, John or Paul? They are the authors of most of the books of the New Testament in the bible. Are they not?
The New Testament is the words of Mark, Mathew, Luke, John and Paul, and not the words of Jesus.
Hundreds of gospels were in circulation in the first century AD. Some of them are still around and can be read online: the gospel of James, the gospel of Thomas and the gospel of Barnabas. Other gospels were by Peter, Mary Magdeline, and Mary's mother.
Among the gospels that have not survived might have been the gospel of Jesus.
Muslims are commanded to believe in what was given to Jesus. What did the Christians do to that which was given to the prophet of God, Jesus? None of the books in the New Testament is written by Jesus? The bible says Jesus could write. John 8:8, Luke 4,16
Injeel can only be the book given to Jesus
Both verses quoted by Mr. Khaled confirm that the Injeel (gospel) was the book given to Jesus. Here is the other one he quotes.
The Quran says: Subsequent to them, we sent Jesus, the son of Mary, confirming the previous scripture, the Torah. We gave him the Gospel (Injil), containing guidance and light, and confirming the previous scriptures, the Torah, and augmenting its guidance and light, and to enlighten the righteous. 5:46
Let me quote one more.
The Quran says: "And Allah will teach him (Jesus) the Book and Wisdom, the Law and the Gospel," 3:48
According to the Quran, the injeel (gospel) is the book given to Jesus, not to Mark, Mathew, Luke, John and Paul.
The injeel given to Jesus is not around in this world any more, is it Mr. Khaled?
Mr. Khaled Wrote:
These previous Revelations include the following:
We did reveal the Torah (Tawrat), wherein is guidance and a light ... Q5:44
And already have we written in the Psalms (Zabur) after the reminder that the earth shall my righteous servants inherit.' Q21:105
My Response:
The old switcheroo
Mr. Khaled takes the tawrat and zabur (Torah and Psalms) to mean the bible. That is the deceptive switcheroo. Let us bite! Please read the verses he quoted along with the following verses of the Quran.
The Quran says: Prior to this (Quran) , the book of Moses served as a guide, and was a blessing. 11:17
The Quran says: Prior to this, the book of Moses was the guide and mercy. This book, (the Qur'an) is in the Arabic language and it confirms and validates (the book of Moses). 46:12
Tawrat (Torah) was the guide, of course, but prior to the Quran! These verses suggest clearly that the Quran has superseded the Tawrat (Torah).
The tawrat and the Injeel are not available in their original form, or in their original languages. Where is the proof? In the bible, of course!
The Bible says: "How can you say, 'We are wise, and the law of the LORD is with us'? But, behold, the false pen of the scribes has made it into a lie. Jer 8:8
As for the New Testament:
The Bible says: Now concerning the unmarried, I have no command of the Lord, but I give my opinion as one who by the Lord's mercy is trustworthy. 1 Cor 7: 25
Naturally the words in which Paul expresses his personal opinion are his own. They do not convey the command of God, so they cannot be the "words of God"
Had there been no additions, deletions, or interpolation in the previous scriptures, the Quran would still supersede. Its language is alive, while that of the book given to Jesus is almost dead. That of the Tawrat is certainly dead.
Even if their language were alive, The Quran would still supersede. Other revelations were for specific regions and specific people. The Quran is for all mankind.
The Bible says: But go rather to the lost sheep of the house of Israel. Mat 10:6
The Bible says: But he answered and said, I am not sent but unto the lost sheep of the house of Israel. Mat 15:24
The Quran says: Do you ask them for anything in return? This (Qur'an) is, in fact, a reminder and an advice for the entire world! 12:104
Previous scriptures were for a specific time, while the Quran is for all times to come.
The Quran says: Muhammad (SAW), is not the father of any man among you, but he is the messenger of Allah and the last of the prophets. Allah is very well Aware of all things! 33:40
Even if the previous scripture had been for all mankind, the quran would still have superseded, because the Quran was given to the last of the series of prophets. None of the previous prophets claimed to be the last. They specifically promised other prophets to follow.
The Bible says: I will raise them up a Prophet from among their brethren, like unto thee, and will put my words in his mouth; and he shall speak unto them all that I shall command him. Deu 18:18
The Bible says: [Jesus said] "And I will pray the Father, and he will give you another Counselor," John 14:16
The Quran supersedes merely because of the timeline. It is the most recent edition of the divine book, the final update. The scripture before it was around 600 years earlier.
It supersedes because the older scriptures did not claim to be the last communication. Their purity was not guaranteed. God made this promise only for the Quran.
The Quran says: Indeed, it is Our responsibility to have it collected (compiled) and read (as a book). 75:17
By the time the Quran was revealed the world had evolved and become global enough. Record keeping had improved considerably. Thus it remains pristine and corruption free.
That the Quran supersedes the previous scriptures is not just my opinion. The quran says so, clearly and unambiguously
The Quran says: And, (Oh Muhammad, SAW) We have revealed to you the truth in this book _ (the Qur'an). It confirms the scriptures that were (revealed) before it, and it supersedes them. 5:48
Is the loss of the previous scriptures worrisome?
But why worry, the quran assures us that the same teachings and commandments are in the quran now.
The Quran says: The same religion has He established for you as that which He enjoined on Noah - the which We have sent by inspiration to thee - and that which We enjoined on Abraham, Moses, and Jesus: 42:13
The Quran says: To begin with, people had only one religion. Later on, they differed. 10:19
The differences in the religions today represent the direction and the degree to which they have deviated from the original message _ the religion of Islam.
People deviated from the religion of Moses. God sent Jesus to correct the course, and to remind them of the true religion of Abraham, Islam.
The Quran says: And (remember) when Jesus son of Mary said, "Oh children of Israel, I have really been appointed the messenger of Allah towards you. I confirm the Torah, the scriptures revealed before me, 61:6
Those who believed in Jesus returned to the religion of Abraham, Islam. Those who chose to stick to the deviation are now called the Jews.
With time, the followers of Jesus began to deviate. The last messenger of God came to remind the deviants and all the people of the world.
The Quran says: We have revealed this book, (the Qur'an), as a blessing and as a confirmation of the book that came before it. 6:92
Those who believed the last messenger returned to the religion of Abraham, Islam. Those who chose to stick to the deviation are now called the Christians.
The real purpose of the messengers of God, every last one of them, was to bring people to the original religion of God, Islam!
Believe in the previous Books
Mr. Khaled quotes another verse of the Quran to emphasize that the Muslims must believe in the previous scriptures:
who believe in what is revealed to thee (Muhammad), and what was revealed before thee, and of the hereafter they are sure. 2:4
The word bible does not appear above. The Quran does not mention "bible" even once. In fact, the word "bible" does not appear even in the bible!
True, Muslims must believe that there were other books sent by God. They do! To know what they contained, one must have the uncorrupted copy of those books, in their original language.
The passage of time saw corruption creep into them. Their languages fell into disuse. God sent the same message afresh. Different times, different people and different languages, but the same message!
The Book of David came because the book of Moses became ridden with errors. Jesus was given the gospel (Injeel) because the Book of David became corrupt with the passage of time. Similarly, The Quran was revealed because the Injeel was lost.
The previous scriptures did not need to survive till the doomsday, only till the next prophet and the next book were destined to arrive on the scene. The Quran shall remain pristine forever!
To claim that the Tawrat (Torah) is uncorrupted is to say that the Book of David was unnecessary, and so also the Book of Jesus.
Why believe in what was revealed before Quran?
The Quran says: who believe in what is revealed to thee (Muhammad), and what was revealed before thee, and of the hereafter they are sure. 2:4
There are many verses of the Quran that say the above. They effectively answer one of the main objections of the unbelievers.
The unbelievers argued: Why would God convey his message through a mortal, who must earn a living and eat, marry and have children, and have family ties. Angels should be sent for the spiritual guidance of mankind. Man is unclean and born of a sexual liaison. The quran quotes them:
The Quran says: They say, "What sort of messenger is this? He eats food and moves about in the bazaars. Why wasn't an angel sent down with him to be a co-warner?" 25:7
The Quran says: . they cynically raised the question, "Has Allah appointed a human being to be His messenger?" 17:94
The Quran says: "He is just a human like you, . Had Allah wanted, He would have sent angels. 23:24
The Quran says: . "Why did an angel not accompany him?" 11:12
The Quran says: "Why was He not granted gold bracelets, (and other riches)? Why did angels not accompany him as associates?" 43:53
They believed Moses was human and so the argument was thrown back at them.
The Quran says.Ask them, "Who revealed the book that Moses had brought to the people? : 6:91
The Quran says: It was We Who gave Moses the Book 2:87
As to why not an angel:
The Quran says: Say, "Had angels populated the earth, _ moving about peacefully in it _ We would certainly have sent another angel from heaven as a messenger for them." 17:95
The Quran says: (Oh messenger)! Prior to you, too, every messenger We ever sent consumed food and moved about in the bazaars. 25:20
The Jews and the Christians had deviated from the religion of Abraham. Yet their books maintained the belief in One God, the life to come, the Day of Judgment, and hell and heaven. They believed that God raised men to convey his message to the people.
The Quran invited them to return to the true religion when it said, "believe in this revelation, as well as the revelation before it"
Mr. Khaled Wrote:
Those Muslims who believe that the above verses prove that the Bible has been corrupted have obviously not pondered over the fact that the Quran explicitly says elsewhere that it is impossible for God's Word to be changed:
for them are good tidings in the life of this world, and in the future too; there is no changing the words of God! That is the mighty happiness! Q10:64
Called liars too were apostles before thee; but they were patient of being called liars and of being hurt until our help came to them; for there is none to change the words of God - now has there come to thee the story of those He sent. Q6:34
My Response:
Mr. Khaled's argument seems to be, that because the Quran says "there is no changing of the words of God" and "there is none to change the words of God", therefore the bible is not corrupted.
Actually, "the words of God" mean the "promise of God" and the original contract God entered into with man. It certainly does not refer to the bible.
Both contracting parties have a signed copy of the contract. It continues to be in force, even if one party alters the terms in its OWN COPY.
God has not changed any of the terms. His proclamations and promises are the same and he assures us that "There is no changing the words of God!"
People who later chose to call themselves Christians have changed the terms in THEIR COPY of the contract with God. These changes are illegal and invalid.
God warns that Man will be held accountable for his end of the bargain. The original contract is in force and "there is none to change the words of God"
God sent down revelations that narrated past incidences and contained the road map to righteousness, and the rules of conduct. The Contract specified the price at which paradise could be earned.
The Christians have changed the words in THEIR COPY of the contract.
Fraud it is to alter the words of a signed contract. Erasing rules from the rule book does not render them ineffective. Interpolating fantasies in a book of history corrupts the book, not history. Changing the directions on the road map cannot bring the destination any closer. It will surely get you lost!
Should God abide by the changes that the Christians have arbitrarily made to their copy of the contract?
The price for paradise is the same. Slashing the price in your copy of the catalogue does not lower the price.
The Christians have chosen to change the words in the book given to them.
They interpolated the notion of salvation by blood _ a human sacrifice. They allege that sins of the guilty were cleansed by spilling the blood of an innocent man, as if blood was a detergent. Then we are told that the man sacrificed was not a man. He was God! That makes it God sacrifice!
Let us consider what the verses mean:
Ignoring completely the context, as also the verses that precede and follow, Mr. Khaled chose to emphasize these two phrases.
"there is no changing the words of God!" 10:64; "there is none to change the words of God" 6:34
Mr. Khaled's argument is A) The bible is the word of God B) The Quran says the word of God cannot be changed, and therefore C) The bible is the uncorrupted word of God.
The context of "Words of God" in 10:64
The Quran says: "for them are good tidings in the life of this world, and in the future too; there is no changing the words of God! That is the mighty happiness!" 10:64
This verse has four parts:
First part: "for them are good tidings in the life of this world" This is the promise of God!
Second part: "and in the future too". The promise of God is being extended to the future, the life to come.
Third part: "there is no changing the words of God!" God assures man that He does not renege on his promise!
Fourth part: "That is the mighty happiness!"
How can one lift the phrase, "words of God", clear out of middle of the verse and give it a meaning other than the "promise of God"?
Is that how you interpret the bible? Lift one phrase out of the verse, and interpret it in isolation?
For context, please read a few verses before 10:64. They promise mankind that all deeds are being recorded and that God will hold court on the Day of Judgment.
Verse 10:55 has these exact words "Indeed, the promise of Allah is absolutely true!" (The exact transliteration of Arabic: Inna Waada Allahe Haqqun), and that is what is meant by the phrase "words of God"
How can the phrase in verse 10:64, "the words of God", be assigned any other meaning besides, "the promise of God"? Why would it refer to the "words" in the bible?
The Context of "Words of God" in 6:34
The Quran says: Called liars too were apostles before thee; but they were patient of being called liars and of being hurt until our help came to them; for there is none to change the words of God - now has there come to thee the story of those He sent. 6:34
The last messenger was being persecuted at that time. This verse advises him that messengers before him were also abused and called liars. Help of God arrives only after they have braved the initial persecution. This happens to be the established practice of God. None can change the destiny appointed by God (the words of God).
Read a few verses before and after verse 6:34. No other interpretation is possible. There is no reason to think that the phrase "words of God" refers to the bible.
Interpreting the phrases in Isolation
Perhaps Mr. Khaled would still insist that we should consider the phrases in isolation. That the "words of God" cannot mean anything else except the words of the bible.
So let us consider the phrases in isolation. What Mr. Khaled quoted was the English translation. The original phrase is in Arabic
Interpreting "No changing the words of God" in Isolation
The phrase in 10:64 (Transliteration): "La Tabdeela Lay Kalimat Illah.
Kalimat Illah = words of God; Lay = for; La = No; Tabdeela = changing, altering, converting, replacement _ Arabic dictionary, by J Milton Cowan.
No Tabdeela for the "words of God" means "No replacement for the words of God". Replacing the words of God with synonyms would corrupt the scriptures.
The Quran says: And recite (without modification) the revelation from the book of your Lord. No one may change the words of your Lord! (If you did) you will not find any safe place from Him. 18:27
Rendition of the words of God into another language often fails to communicate the true spirit of the scriptures. God's words cannot really be translated.
No Tabdeela for the "words of God" also means "there is no alternate for the words of God". No other book should be relied upon to tell us about what lies past the threshold of death.
Also, words from other books cannot provide rules of conduct and the laws of God.
Interpreting "None to change the words of God" in Isolation
No one has the authority to cause any substitution, alteration, replacement, or a change in the words of God. There is no pope or a priest class in Islam. No one can dare to change the laws of God!
According to the dictionaries, both Arabic and English, WORD does not just refer to the combination of alphabets. It means: order, command; promise, proclamation; saying, declaration, discourse.
WORD means Order, Command
don't move till I give the word>
The phrases (no changing the words of God 10:64; none to change the words of God 6:34) mean that the Commands of God encounter no resistance. It is inconceivable that God would fail to achieve anything he intends.
Elsewhere, the Quran conveys that meaning using other words and in different contexts.
The Quran says: He is Allah! .. The command and control belong to Him, and to Him you shall all have to return! 28:70
The Quran says: The Command of Allah is final .. 13:41
The Quran says: Beware! The creation and the command (over it), belong to him (exclusively) 7:54
The Quran says: Once He decrees anything, He (merely) says to it, "Be!" and it becomes. 2:117
The Quran says: Indeed, once that time arrives, the decree of Allah cannot be delayed. If you only knew!" 71:4
Word means Promise, Declaration
word> The Quran says: ..The promise of God is the (absolute) truth. What could be more credible and incontrovertible than the word of God? 4:122>
The Contract with God: This life is a test. Man shall have paradise if he believes and lives righteously. It is important for man to know that God has the ability and intention of keeping his end of the bargain.
And Allah assures man that He never goes back on his words, not only in the two verses quoted by Mr. Khaled, but elsewhere too, in explicit terms.
The Quran says: They swear by Allah a lot, claiming emphatically that Allah will not bring the dead back to life. On the contrary, . this is the promise incumbent upon Him. 16:38
The Quran says: That day . We will begin the creation anew . This is a promise incumbent upon Us. We are definitely going to fulfill (Our promise)! 21:104
The Quran says: They will live in it (paradise) for ever. The promise of Allah is firm, indeed. He is the most Powerful, the Wisest. 31:9
The Quran says: There, anything they desire shall be theirs; and there, they shall live forever. That promise is a definite obligation upon your Lord! 25:16
The Quran says: Oh all you people, listen! Of course the promise of Allah is absolutely true! So do not ever let the life of this world deceive you, .. 35:5
The Quran says: Surely, Allah does not renege on His promise! 13:31
The Quran says: His promise is (simply) bound to be fulfilled. 73:18
Word means Saying, Decree, Discourse
The Quran says: The word of Allah is perfectly fair and accurate. None can dare change His decrees. He hears-all and knows all! 6:115>
The phrase can also mean the "decrees of God" and the "discourse of God" There is no changing of the proclamations of God, because He has the ability to bring His decrees to destiny. There is none to change the proclamations of God.
God did not just create all things, but has also decreed what their destiny shall be. All things big and small _ from the sun and the moon to the blade of grass will run out their course in accordance with a predestined plan. All this is to test man.
He will not be brought to account in this life when he disobeys or revolts. His deeds are being recorded. Man has an appointment with God on the Day of Judgment.
God proclaimed that! "There is no changing the words of (proclamations of; destiny appointed by) God" 10:64. God is the absolute Master of this universe and there is "none to change the words (proclamations) of God" 6:34
The same subject has been elaborated in the Quran. Just a few of such verses are quoted below:
The Quran says: .. He (Allah) created everything, and then ordained its destiny in a precise manner. 25:2
The Quran says: .. Indeed, Allah it is Who has appointed the destiny for every single thing. 65:3
The Quran says: ..He has created the sun and the moon as measures (for the passage of time). Such is the destiny appointed by the most Powerful and the most Aware. 6:96
The Quran says: The sun proceeds towards its marked destination. This is the destiny appointed by the Mightiest and the most Knowledgeable! 36:38
The Quran says: No calamity (ever) strikes the earth _ or you _ that is not (already written) in the book of decrees.. 57:22
The Quran says: It is He Who . decreed a term (of life) for you. There is another scheduled appointment for you _ (the day of Resurrection).. 6:2
The Quran says: .The verdict of Allah has been decreed; else their matter would certainly be brought to a close right away.. 42:21
Mr. Khaled might still insist upon his interpretation
Mr. Khaled might still insist that the phrases should be divorced from their context, and interpreted only in isolation. He may argue that God has rendered human beings incapable of changing the words of the previous scriptures.
The Quran is a divine book. It can withstand anything he can throw at it.
Christians concede that the bible is not a narration by Jesus, but rather about Jesus by other men. It consists of the words of men that are inspired by God.
Whether he was God, or messenger of God, only the words coming out of Jesus' mouth can be the words of God. There is a complete consensus among the Christian scholars that he preached in Aramaic language. Only Aramaic words could be the words of God.
If Mr. Khaled's interpretation was valid, it would apply only to the scriptures in the Aramaic language, which is now almost a dead language.
A phrase in Greek can be translated into English in a number of ways. Myriads of English translations of the Greek bible are different and yet valid.
Greek bible, too, is merely a translation of what Jesus said in Aramaic. Different translations into Greek of what Jesus actually said in Aramaic must have existed back in those days. Only one of them has survived.
If the original version of what Jesus said in Aramaic was available now, one might find no change in them.
God did not say that the language of the words of God will not fall into disuse. Did He?
Mr. Khaled Wrote:
Let us summarize the claims that were presented so far:
- The Quran is preserved.
- God's Revelations which preceded the Quran include the Torah, the Psalms, and the Gospel.
These Books make up a large portion of the Holy Bible.
- The Quran, the Torah, the Psalms, and the Gospel are all the Word of Allah.
- God's Word does not change.
- The revelations that came before the Quran have become corrupted.
- Although Muslims should believe that these previous Books are the genuine Revelations from God, they have to trust only the Quran as the final revelation and the only one that is preserved.
We now have to deal with this logic:
- The Quran, the Torah, the Psalms and the Gospel are all Allah's Word.
- The current Torah, Psalms and Gospel are corrupted.
- The final word of Allah, the Quran is preserved.
1st Conclusion: Some of Allah's Words are corrupted
2nd Conclusion: Some of Allah's Words are preserved.
Based on the above generalizations we can construct these deductive arguments:
Major premise: Some of Allah's Words are corrupted.
Minor premise: The Quran is Allah's Word.
Conclusion: The Quran could be corrupted.
Or we could do it another way:
Major premise: Some of Allah's Words are preserved.
Minor premise: The Torah, the Psalms, and the Gospel are Allah's Words.
Conclusion: The Torah, the Psalms, and the Gospel could be preserved.
My Response:
It should now be obvious that:
A)The Quran is Allah's word. The torah, the psalms, and the Injeel were the words of God sent by God previously.
B) The original Torah, Zaboor, and the Injeel do not exist. Corrupted copies purported to be the translations of Torah, Zaboor and the Injil are current.
C) The final word of the Allah is preserved.
ONLY CONCLUSION POSSIBLE: The languages of the scriptures sent previously are not spoken any longer, while the language of the latest editions of the word of God is alive and well.
Therefore, the words of God have always been around. Prior to the Quran, the previous scriptures were the guidance from God. Now only the Quran is the word of God and the guidance.
Mr. Khaled Wrote:
The Main Problem
Since Allah allowed his previous Revelations to be corrupted by weak human people, this leads to one of the following assumptions about Allah:
- Allah is a weak god; he could not protect his previous Revelations. He also gains more power and might throughout time, because he supposedly is now able to protect his last revelation, the Quran.
My Response:
God does not evolve. Humans do!
God is not weak. He does not HAVE TO choose prophets only from a single tribe even when they kill His prophets. John the Baptist and Jesus were not the only ones whose murder they planned. Their earlier generations, too, had killed the prophets of God.
God is all powerful! He raised prophets in all lands and to all people, and conveyed His message through them.
God could have kept pristine the revelations sent to each of the hundreds of thousands of prophets. It is just as easy for God to repeat His message in another language. All languages and all people belong to God!
When language, record keeping and learning had evolved sufficiently, God sent the final revelation for all human beings, and for all times to come.
Mr. Khaled Wrote:
- Allah does not care about people being misled by counterfeit revelations. And yet he will still punish individuals with hell fire because they follow a corrupted Message even though they may have not come to the realization that Allah had allowed it to be corrupted. That means Allah is unjust.
My Response:
In this life we see murderers going scot-free, and innocent people being tried, convicted and executed for crimes they did not commit. Does that mean God is unjust?
This life is a test. This world is a place for action, and the afterlife is a place for consequences. Complete and absolute justice shall prevail on and after the Day of Judgment.
It is the promise of God that His revelation would be available to all people and at all times. That promise is fulfilled.
Narrow-minded are those who insist that revelation must come to them only through the "chosen race".
Nothing but prejudice keeps people from reading the Quran and gaining access to His revelations!
Mr. Khaled Wrote:
In light of the above, how can we trust that the Quran is preserved if these three Revelations are corrupted? How can a person trust that Allah did not fail to protect his so-called final revelation, the Quran, when he was too weak to prevent people from tampering with his previous Messages?
Maybe Allah needs to a send a fifth revelation? Perhaps he has already sent down this fifth book, and that is actually the revelation given to Baha'ullah the founder of the Baha'i faith?
More importantly, how do Muslims reconcile their position with Allah's claim in the Quran that "there is no changing the words of God"?
My Response:
How can we trust the Quran?
By reading and studying it, of course!
By taking up the challenge it throws! No one is able to bring even a single verse that can hold up to the Quran.
Because of the fact that there are no contradictions in the Quran!
Tawrat, Zaboor, and Injeel are only the prominent books sent to those whom the Christians call "the chosen race"
According to one hadeeth, over a hundred thousand messengers have been sent to the earth to all people and at different times.
As long as the Quran remains pristine, there is no need for a "fifth" book. God has promised that it will remain pristine!
The last messenger said unequivocally that he was the last messenger. All those claiming to be messengers after him are pretenders.
Mr. Khaled Wrote:
Muslims, you have to make a decision and choose one of these alternatives:
- The Quran is preserved and the earlier Revelations are corrupted. In that case, Allah is either weak or he is unjust. That is the only explanation for his preservation of the Quran and letting people corrupt his previous Revelations.
My Response:
God is neither weak nor unjust. That is the only explanation Mr. Khaled considered based on the faulty premises.
Mr. Khaled Wrote:
- The Quran is corrupted like the other Revelations. Then you should either not read it since you do not read other corrupted Revelations, or maybe you should read these other corrupted Revelations just as you insist on reading the corrupted Quran.
My Response:
The Quran is the only scripture whose original language is alive. Only it can be, AND IS uncorrupted.
Read the bible by all means. Do not forget the Hindu and the Buddhist scriptures, either. They too may be the corrupted versions of the words of God.
But please do not be prejudiced against the Quran. Read it too. There is no other way to appreciate the difference between a corrupted version of the "words of God", and the pristine "words of God"
Mr. Khaled Wrote:
- The Quran is preserved, and the previous Revelations have also been preserved. That means then you should read these authentic Revelations (the Bible) for yourself.
My Response:
Nonsense! The bible is not preserved. We know that! Catholic bible has 73 books, Protestant bible has 66. Either the Catholics added to the words of God, or the Protestants deleted seven books that were the words of God.
Then there is also the Orthodox bible, and the Mormon bible.
Textus Siniaticus, Textus Alexandricus, and Textus Vaticanus are copies of the bible discovered by the Archaeologists in the twentieth century. They differ significantly from the one considered bible by the modern day Christians.
Mr. Khaled Wrote:
- The Quran is corrupted but the earlier Revelations are preserved. Obviously, you should then abandon the Quran and read the Bible.
My Response:
Nonsense!
The New International Version of the bible says
[The most reliable early manuscripts and other ancient witnesses do not have Mark 18: 9-20]
And
[The earliest and most reliable manuscripts and other ancient witnesses do not have John 7:53 - John 8:11]
Is that not a euphemism for FAKE verses added to the words of Gods!
Mr. Khaled Wrote:
Just a second, I'm not finished yet.
If you picked option number three, then you will be faced with another problem. The Quran contradicts these previous Revelations in many essential points. That means that the Quran is a false message which cannot be from God since God is not the author of confusion. He could not reveal a message that contradicts his previous Messages.
My Response:
The quran does contradict the books masquerading as the previous scriptures.
It corrects the bible! Pornographic accounts and even incest have found their way into it. Common sense tells us that the words of God should not contain pornography.
Mr. Khaled Wrote:
If you do not like these alternatives, then tell me:
What exactly do you think is wrong with my above observations and conclusions?
If you do not accept my premises and therefore reject my conclusions, then:
PROVE TO ME THAT THE QURAN IS PRESERVED.
You have to do that in a rational way without quoting the Quran since that would only be a repetition of the claim, not a proof, or trying to prove that the previous Revelations are corrupted which in no way proves the Quran not to be corrupted, or providing me with (what I consider fake) scientific miracles in the Quran. I want you to resolve the philosophical problem outlined above.
Show me logically and rationally how the Muslim assertion of a perfectly preserved Quran together with an alleged corruption of God's earlier Revelations is not an insult to God's perfect justice and great power.
My Response:
Ok
Let us proceed.
1) Three of the seven copies officially prepared just 14 years after the death of the last prophet are preserved in Museums, in Topkapi, Istanbul, in Taskent, Azerbaijan, and in Cairo, Egypt.
http://www.unesco.org/webworld/mdm/1997/eng/uzbekistan/uzbekistan.html
2) Millions of people memorize the entire Quran from the first to the last verse. None of the other religious books of the world is memorized by even a single person.
3) Once a year, the entire Quran is recited from memory in front of large audiences at hundreds of thousands of places around the globe. None of the other religious books is recited in its entirety in public, at any place in the world.
4) The Arabic language is alive. It is the official language of scores of countries of the world, and it is one of only six official languages of the United Nations. The original language of none of the other religious books has survived.
5) The Quran became the law of the land as soon as it was revealed. Since then there has never been a day when the Quran has not served as the law of the land someplace on earth. None of the other religious book has ever served as the law of the land ever, not even for a day.
The difference between the Quran and all the rest of the religious books of the world is so stark and striking. How can anyone even begin to compare?
And the Quran says;
Sorry, Mr. Khaled forbade me to quote the quran!
Besides the non-Quranic sources should suffice for anyone who has even an iota of conscience left. Even an iota of consciousness left!
Munir Munshey,
Feel free to contact me at Munir0728@yahoo.com
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